Acting The Part Amidst Adversity: A Conversation With Aaron Matthew Atkisson

Nora McInerny:

Life sometimes has a way of blindsiding you with a feeling of being overwhelmed at the worst possible time. That's why you have your self-care, your coping strategies. That's why you have us. I'm Nora McInerny, and this is The Head Start: Embracing the Journey, a podcast where we'll be taking all those things you usually save for your friend group out into the open so we can all find a bit of optimism.

For those battling Chronic Migraine, these conversations are going to be even more helpful and relatable, so definitely stick around. This show is brought to you in partnership with AbbVie. So first, let's hear some important safety information, and stay tuned to the end of the podcast for more.

Speaker 1:

Indication:  BOTOX^® (onabotulinumtoxinA) is a prescription medicine that is injected into muscles and used to prevent headaches in adults with chronic migraine who have 15 or more days each month with headache lasting 4 or more hours each day in people 18 years and older.

It is not known whether BOTOX is safe and effective to prevent headaches in patients with migraine who have 14 or fewer headache days each month (episodic migraine).

Important Safety Information: BOTOX may cause serious side effects that can be life threatening. Get medical help right away if you have any of these problems any time (hours to weeks) after injection of BOTOX:

• Problems swallowing, speaking, or breathing, due to weakening of associated muscles, can be severe and result in loss of life. You are at the highest risk if these problems are preexisting before injection. Swallowing problems may last for several months.
• Spread of toxin effects. The effect of botulinum toxin may affect areas away from the injection site and cause serious symptoms, including loss of strength and all-over muscle weakness; double vision; blurred vision; drooping eyelids; hoarseness or change or loss of voice; trouble saying words clearly; loss of bladder control; trouble breathing; and trouble swallowing.

Please see Important Safety Information, including Boxed Warning, within this podcast or on the website below.

Nora McInerny:

If we were in a room together, live and in person, where we could look one another in the eye, I would ask you to raise your hand if any of the following apply to you. And if you don't like audience participation, that's fine. Neither do I. You could just think of raising your hand if the following applies to you. Here we go. It's a lot of work to take care of yourself and your home. It's a lot of work to take care of yourself and your home and your kids. It's a lot of work to take care of yourself and your home and your kids and your parents. It's a lot of work to do any and all of this during a migraine attack.

Today's guest, Aaron Matthew Atkisson, is a person who would have raised his hand metaphorically or physically to all of those questions because Aaron is an actor in Michigan who has been living with Chronic Migraine for a long time. Aaron is also a single parent and a caregiver to his mother. He's a part of that sandwich generation and a part of a group of caregivers, an unsung and undervalued part of our society that is just as essential as it is under-recognized. Care work is hard work. Not only is it essential to the functioning of our society and to our well-being, it is valuable work.

Our conversation with Aaron is for everyone who has found themselves sandwiched between their needs and the needs of others. And our hope is that this conversation offers you comfort and companionship. It is not just you. This is hard stuff, especially if, like Aaron, you are living with Chronic Migraine. So, as always, I remain not a doctor, but I am joined by my friend, Dr. Christopher Rhyne. Dr. Rhyne is a headache specialist and also one of the most delightful healthcare professionals I've ever met.

Dr. Christopher Rhyne:

Nora, you're so sweet. I want to try to figure out how to get you like an honorary doctor.

Nora McInerny:

You can't give me any awards.

Dr. Christopher Rhyne:

Yeah, we can try to figure out how to get you the honorary MD because of all of the effort that you're putting in to look out for people living with Chronic Migraine, and the way that you're bringing this to light for the listeners is special and something that you do. So we can get you a couple of letters to put at the end of your name. It'll be great.

Nora McInerny:

But it is an honor to do this work. It is an honor to be a place where people will share their stories, and it's been very meaningful to get all the feedback from people who have experienced Chronic Migraine who have such similar stories. I think this is why it's so important for people to share what they're going through because someone else needs that story. Now, let's hear from today's guest, Aaron Matthew Atkisson.

Aaron, before we get started.

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Yes.

Nora McInerny:

...I have a question for you, and I like to start out with the hardest-hitting questions possible. What is a movie you could watch a million times and never get sick of?

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Gosh, this is going to be so cliché, but I'm going to say it’s The Matrix.

Nora McInerny:

The only thing that I remember about The Matrix is that we rented it the old-fashioned way. We had to go to the store and rent it, and the entire movie, all my siblings, my mom, my dad, all on a tiny three-person couch in our living room, and my mom kept going, "Are we in The Matrix now?"

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

That is great.

Nora McInerny:

Okay. So, Aaron, you are an actor now, which is so cool, but-

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

I am.

Nora McInerny:

... obviously that wasn't always the case. I love talking about people's careers. Did you always lean towards the arts? What is it like to change careers?

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Yeah, I've always been a creative person. Music was my first love. I painted a little bit, you know,  when I was a kid, but music I kind of really gravitated towards, and I kind of got sucked into the rat race of the 9 to 5, or more like a nine to 10:00 PM.

I worked a very, very  strenuous, labored job for almost two decades. And then I had a work injury that didn't allow me to do my career, so I needed to find something to fill my time, something to put food on the table, money in my pocket.

And there were some films going on in the Detroit area, and I thought, "You know what? Let's give this a shot. This looks fun." It wasn't until, I'd say, the last five years really that I've really kind of hit it hard and gone in professional mode and really have been able to make a living off of it.

Nora McInerny:

That is so cool, and that is so brave. So you also live with Chronic Migraine, which I have learned from doing this podcast is something that is so much more complex than many of us understand. Tell me what triggers a migraine attack for you? What are your symptoms?

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Wow. So, there's a lot of things that could trigger a migraine attack for me. One of my top triggers is heat, getting overheated. Unfortunately, you know, I don't get to enjoy the outdoors during the summer as much because I'm constantly trying to cool myself down. So, one of my first migraine attacks that I can remember was when I got overheated and I got a migraine attack, and it was terrifying not knowing what was going on.

So, throughout the years, I've recognized that heat is one of my top triggers, so I have to make sure that I stay hydrated. I have to... I use ice packs to cool myself down. There's so many different things that I've had to try over the years. Some work great. Some don't work at all. Sometimes, it depends on the migraine attack, and sometimes, it depends on the trigger. I could have a rough night's sleep and wake up with one, and if that happens, my day's usually over. You might as well just say goodbye to me for the next, you know, day or two.

Nora McInerny:

What you just said too, that's something that was really touching about your story is that when you're in the middle of a migraine attack, you just said like, “Well, say goodbye to me for the day." That it's really hard to be there for the people who rely on you, and when you're in the middle of it's very hard to vocalize what you're going through. Walk us through what you're feeling when those migraine attacks hit.

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Well, there's a couple different layers to that. Emotionally, you feel very defeated. You're scared because you don't know if this is going to take up your entire day, or if this is going to last days, or if you're going to get away with it for a few hours. I'm a single parent, so I have to make sure that I'm doing everything possible to take care of my kids and make sure that they're set up.

Thankfully, they're older now, so they're kind of self-sufficient, and they understand, "If dad has a migraine attack, this is what has to happen." So, being able to take care of them, that's my top priority. But I also know that if I don't take care of myself, then I can't take care of them at all. So, there's a balance there. As far as like, the physical aspect, I'll get real dizzy. I experience nausea. Nausea isn't there all the time, thankfully. So, I have ginger gummies that I take for that. Sometimes, they help settle the stomach. So, I'm fortunate with that because I know there's a lot of people that have different triggers, and we all have those different things.

Nora McInerny:

We've actually talked about this in, you know, various ways throughout the show, and I want to get your take on it, but there is a bit of a disparity between how women and men are treated when they voice the need for space during a migraine attack. We have a culture that really insists that men be tough. "Suck it up. Get over it." that kind of stuff. What's been your experience with that when you have a migraine attack?

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

So that stigma definitely follows me around. I don't exactly look like the type that would just lay down and tap out. But, you know, over the years, when I was climbing telephone poles for a living, I did everything possible to hide the struggle. I remember an instance where it took everything in me to not fall off my ladder coming down. And it took so much for me to have the courage to call my supervisor and say, "Hey, look, I can't work the rest of the day." I do remember in my work parking lot trying to recuperate so that I could drive an hour home.

So, the emotional side of that, of having the courage as a man to say, "Okay, I can't do this," after doing that kind of work for... at that point for probably 15 years, and it takes a lot to say that I can't do this. It's a lot to say that I'm not strong enough on my own to manage my disease. It takes a lot to go to your doctor and say, "Hey, look, something's going on." Because as men, like you said, you're told to tough it up. You're told to man up. You know, swallow it, deal with it on your own. Nobody wants to hear what you're saying. We just want you to do the things that you're supposed to do as a man.  And I'd say, over the last five or six years, I personally have shifted my mindset with that because I have reached out for help because it's not just about me. It's about my family. It's about my kids. It's about how I affect them as a parent and as a father, and showing my children that it is strong to reach out for help when you can't do it on your own. It's much bigger than saying that you can do it by yourself.

Nora McInerny:

So, Dr. Rhyne, back in season one, we talked with Qasim quite a bit, and he said that it felt like there was a very, very small community of men who speak up and admit that they have Chronic Migraine. And he had said that it's that lack of conversation that is probably preventing men from seeking help and getting diagnosed or getting treated. Do you have any stats on the gender breakdown of men versus women who have Chronic Migraine and if there's a measurable disparity between the care for both?

Dr. Christopher Rhyne:

So, the prevalence of Chronic Migraine is significantly higher in females than in males. So, studies have shown that the ratio of female to male migraine patients is roughly three to one, meaning that for every male migraine patient out there, then there's approximately three female migraine patients. The Global Burden of Disease Study is a comprehensive research effort that has consistently highlighted migraine as a leading cause of disability worldwide.

We're talking about more than a billion people, particularly amongst women. So, men with migraine generally have less severe migraine attacks. And unfortunately, what that translates into is that they're less likely to seek treatment, and if they do, they're less likely to receive a diagnosis versus women.

Nora McInerny:

When it comes to men with Chronic Migraine, are there unique challenges to finding care that you've seen?

Dr. Christopher Rhyne:

Yeah. In my experience, and as I look at the patients that I've treated in the past, there are several challenges. Let's take the perception and awareness, for example. Men might not recognize their symptoms as migraine attacks. They might underestimate that severity of their symptoms and then ultimately dismiss what they're experiencing as just a headache to avoid that stigma and ultimately avoid that conversation.

And I've seen that stigma you know, around expressing that vulnerability or acknowledging need for help be a barrier to diagnosis and treatment for men. Nora, the bottom line is that men are less likely to talk to a doctor about their migraine attacks and about the symptoms they're experiencing.

Nora McInerny:

We'll be right back with more from Aaron, so stick around

Nora McInerny:

Welcome back to The Head Start: Embracing the Journey. Let's get back into my conversation with Aaron Matthew Atkisson.

I love what you said about, like, it's very important for our kids to see that it's very normal to need people. Like, that's normal. That's actually like what we're here on earth for is not to just get through everything alone, but to like, help each other through too, and that's such a powerful thing to model for them as any adult, but, particularly, as a father. I know that, you know, you're also the primary caregiver for your mother, so you are a part of that sandwich generation where you have-

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Yes.

Nora McInerny:

...kids who count on you and you have a parent who counts on you, and that is a lot of caregiving in the best of circumstances. Tell me about supporting your mom, how that has shaped your perspective on your own Chronic Migraine journey, and where you yourself get support. And I realize that's three questions, so just do your best.

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Okay. So, as far as my mother goes, it's been challenging at the very least because my parents divorced when I was a kid, so my mom, you know, was a single parent as well. We don't have any family besides each other and are nearby. Right now, my mother cannot drive. She's been a very independent person in her entire life. There's all these things that she relies on herself to do that now she has to rely on me to do.

So yeah, so the flip side of the coin is I also relied on my mother to help out with the kids. My girls in Girl Scouts. My oldest daughter is now in soccer. We just started last week, so I'm very excited for that. So, I relied on my mom to help out with some of the extracurriculars for the kids, and if I booked something out of state especially, she would be able to come in and help out. So now I have to also shuffle the things that I'm responsible for as a parent that I was able to lean on my mom for, and she has to lean on me for a lot of the things.

So, there's a lot of learning curves.   I help out with laundry or food or take the garbage out or feed the cats, that kind of stuff. I still have to take her to doctor's appointments, and I have to make sure that my schedule is clear for that. And you know, if something comes up in the acting world, you might audition for a hundred things and, all of a sudden, you get, you know, five of those things you auditioned for, and they're all in the same week, so.

Nora McInerny:

Mm-hmm.

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Or some of them the same day, and you'd have to constantly juggle all that stuff as well.

Nora McInerny:

Yeah, life is unpredictable. Everybody loves to say that, but also, often people who say that are people who have like, a nine-to-five job-

Nora McInerny:

...and don't have Chronic Migraine or another, you know, another chronic disease or also aren't taking care of somebody. You have such a calm, stable energy and...

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Thank you.

Nora McInerny:

I also do want to talk about your career because acting is rather unpredictable. How have you created a schedule at home or when you're on set, knowing that migraine attacks could be lurking?

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Well, we're just going to throw out that word schedule and just strike that because there's no... it's so unpredictable. You just kind of learn to roll with the punches when it comes with that. We have a loose schedule, if you will. From an acting standpoint and somebody who, for many, many years, just powered through it, that's what I do. That's what I do when I'm on set. I watch stuff back that I've been on before, where I know that I have had an excruciating migraine attack. I did a campaign, and I remember the last like three hours, I could feel the migraine attack creeping up.

I was five hours away from home, so we wrapped. I drove to the closest rest area, and I slept for probably two hours. I know my body signals. So I'm very fortunate to recognize that and pay attention to my body. So I'm like, "Okay, yeah, I need to pull over somewhere safe and not try to push it there because not only am I endangering myself, but I'm endangering those around me."

So, and obviously driving and having an attack like that is very unsafe. So that can happen sometimes. I've been on set where I just truck through it. I do the best that I can, and I thankfully have not had to call off of any acting jobs because it's a lottery really. With acting, you throw the spaghetti at the wall, and you hope something sticks.

Nora McInerny:

Mm-hmm.

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

And when that does stick, you get that one job. Not only is it a reputation thing, but it's also a financial thing. It's a financial blow if I miss out on a day's worth of work. It's very important that I stay consistent with that and do everything possible to push through that.

Nora McInerny:

Are there practical things that you have implemented that have made this unpredictable work as an actor more manageable alongside your Chronic Migraine?

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

So, one of the things that I, as an actor, I have to do for self-care is I don't do overnight shoots. Messing up my sleep schedule is a perfect combination for a migraine attack. Unless it's a career-changing move, there has to be some very important things for me to do an overnight shoot. Most of the time, it's not worth it. Another thing that I do is because I have light sensitivity, is I have sunglasses in bulk.

I've got sunglasses for fashion, but I mostly have them for function. So, I have sunglasses stashed everywhere. So those are two of the major things that I do to try to self-care and make sure that I've got an order. As I was saying earlier, I have these ginger gummies, which are very soothing to the stomach. If you've got nausea, they're great.

Nora McInerny:

I have one last question for you, Aaron, which is that you do so much. There's so much going on. What is something that you do just for yourself?

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Well, I enjoy acting. That's for me. I'm a musician too, so I play piano and guitar. My guitar is in my bedroom. I've had this thing for 20-something years.

Nora McInerny:

Oh my God. Your first child.

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Yeah, pretty much. Yeah. Yeah. I used to play music. I used to play like the sports bars and the coffee shops and that kind of stuff, so that was fun.

Nora McInerny:

Honestly, I'm a sucker for people doing what they want to do. It's actually kind of magical when you get to do something that you love. And so, I actually love hearing, like, "Acting is for me." Like, yes, it's a job, you know, and it makes these other aspects of your life possible, but I really think there's beauty in that. And Aaron, this was such a great conversation. I am so glad I got to talk to you today.

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Thank you.

Nora McInerny:

Aaron Matthew Atkisson, thank you so much for being here. You are a treasure. This was a delight. This was an honor. Thank you for your time. Thank you for the generosity of sharing your story with all of us.

Aaron Matthew Atkisson:

Thank you. Thank you.

Nora McInerny:

So Dr. Rhyne, we often hear from guests that they wish that they had found a headache specialist sooner or that they wish they had found a treatment plan that worked for them earlier. Can we talk about that a little bit more?

Dr. Christopher Rhyne:

Yeah. This is, by far, the most common response once patients receive their diagnosis and start an effective treatment for them that I hear from them. So, the National Headache Foundation did a survey on migraine, the Preventing Migraine Attacks: A Current Perspective, and found that when asked about treating their disease, overall, 62% of those respondents wish that they had seen a healthcare provider sooner. They're happy they've finally talked to somebody, they're happy that they found a therapy that's helping them, but they're disappointed because again, they wish they had done it sooner. So, I have a wonderful patient that absolutely speaks to this.

She is a Chronic Migraine patient, and I've been seeing her for several years. She expressed her regret for not seeking out a headache specialist sooner, and every time she comes in to see me, she reminds me about that. And so, this is a disappointment that doesn't just sort of come and go. That every time that they have another quarter, another year, another month where they've been better, and they finally come back and see me, they say, "Man, I wish I'd done this sooner." That's really the thing that I see the most.

Nora McInerny:

That's really heartbreaking to hear, and I have to imagine that a delay like that has a pretty big effect on somebody's treatment journey.

Dr. Christopher Rhyne:

It does. I mean, so what we see is that about one in four people living with Chronic Migraine are candidates for preventive therapy for Chronic Migraine, and a substantial portion of those who might benefit from prevention do not receive it. One of the reasons patients may not receive preventive therapies could be delay in seeking out care, delay in receiving the appropriate diagnosis.

Again, thinking about some of the conversation today, stigma that's preventing you from pursuing that, downplaying and dismissing those symptoms more. One of the academic pieces that jumps out is the CaMEO Study, which showed that 75% of patients who sought evaluation from a healthcare professional for their headaches did not receive a Chronic Migraine diagnosis, though they met the criteria.

Another study on migraine disease, in general, shows that it can take five or more years before patients living with migraine will even start to seek out care from a specialist for their headache and migraine symptoms. And so, it just takes too long, and I think that's one of the really special things about the conversations we have with our patients on the podcast is to try to let the listeners hear what we're talking about, and maybe something rings true for them, and they go seek out that care. They go just try to start that journey.

Nora McInerny:

Dr. Rhyne, you know I appreciate you. I love your perspective. Always one that informs me, and I love that I feel like I am getting such an education not only from our guests but from also my friendship with you. So, thanks for being here.

Dr. Christopher Rhyne:

Absolutely.

Nora McInerny:

I loved this conversation with Aaron Matthew Atkisson so much, as you can probably tell. It was such a good reminder that everyone that you see on this earth is carrying a lot more than they let on and that even people who appear that they have it all together might not. It's a very truly vulnerable thing to be able to speak so openly about your life in the way that Aaron did, and I am so grateful to him for sharing his story, especially as a father. I think it's really important for our kids to know that even the people who are in charge, even the grownups, are just people, and that it is a very deeply human thing to need one another, and it is a deep honor to be there for one another in all kinds of ways. It's easy to think of the grownups as just supporting the kids, and I was really, really touched by the way that Aaron said his kids support him. We are all connected. We all need one another. Thank you so much, Aaron Matthew Atkisson.

If you haven't found a Chronic Migraine treatment plan that is working for you, please reach out to your headache specialist to explore your options. I truly hope this has helped you find a bit of comfort and maybe a smile, maybe. See you next episode and stay tuned for more important safety information.

The Head Start: Embracing the Journey is hosted by myself, Nora McInerny, and Executive Produced by Yvonne Sheehan. Our EP of post-production is James Foster. Our Supervising Producer is Ciara Kaiser. Our Writer is John Irwin, and the show is mixed by Nick Cipriano for BANG Audio Post. Original music by Soundcat Productions and Artlist.

Please see additional Important Safety Information, including Boxed Warning, within this podcast or on the website below.